>>This week on NewsNight, a look at how a chang in immigration policy under the incomin administration in Washington might impact communitie in Florida and key sectors of the economy such as agriculture and tourism.

>>It's so easy to demagogu this issue.

It's so easy to demagogue.

>>To the million of illegal aliens that Joe Biden's released in our countr in violation of federal law., you better start packing now.

>>NewsNight starts now.

[MUSIC] Hello, I'm Steve Mort welcome to NewsNight, where we take an in-depth look at the top stories and issues in Central Florida and how they shape our community.

Tonigh we're going to spend some time looking at immigration.

It's a top priority for president elect Trump, who's promising mass deportations once he begins his second term this month, and a pledge to end programs such as temporary protected status, which shields some immigrants from deportation, could hav a significant effect on Florida, which is home to the largest number of TPS recipients in the nation and where more than a fifth o the population is foreign born.

First tonight NewsNight's Krystel Knowles spoke to three people, all with different immigration experiences, but all of whom share concerns for the future because they fear being targeted for immigration enforcement, they requested we withhold their last names.

>>Rollins College student Daniela has big dreams to be a violinist in an orchestra.

She says she wants a piece of the American dream.

Would you say that you're the dreams and hopes you have in the United States are attainable here, but if you were to go back, they're no longer attainable?

>>No, they're not sustainable.

Honestly.

>>Daniela says her and her family had buil a comfortable life in Venezuela.

But as the economic situation in the country deteriorated, access to healthcare for Daniela's grandparents and mother became scarce.

They're now among the nearly 300,000 recipients of temporary protected status in Florida, according to the Congressional Research Service.

President elect Trump has vowed to end TPS, which protects nearly 1 million people in the US from deportation to countries facing security crisis suc as Ukraine, Haiti and Venezuela.

>>I'm a little afrai of eliminating the TPS because the what am I going to do?

What other, immigration status I can hav if it's not TPS and I don't have enough enough time to consider applying for residency.

>>Ending TPS is just one of the incoming administration' pledges on immigration.

Donald Trump says he's plannin to declare a national emergency to carry out mass deportations of immigrant who are undocumented.

And there might also be a pus to end birthright citizenship.

The possibility of deportation is looming in the back of Olivia's mind.

That is why she wants her identity concealed.

She came to the U.S. from Honduras on a tourist visa six years ago, but overstayed and gave birth to her son, who has special needs.

Olivia says she missed the deadline to apply for TPS because, according to her she had no intention of staying.

A decision she now regrets.

>>I'm nobody anymore.

I'm hidden and I don't exist.

Even though we pay taxes, even though we contribut to the government, I have no right to receive anything in return.

>>Olivia says she's fearful of potential workplace raids.

>>It's truly a constant fear.

Now more than ever.

Every day you don't know when they'll stop you, or when they'll tell you that your time is up.

>>Meanwhile, TPS was never an option for Mexican immigrant Yolanda.

She fears her time in the U.S. may be coming to an end.

Back in 2003, it took her and her family five attempts to cross the southern border.

>>I never thought about comin to the United States.

My reason for comin was for my children, because we had a very har life back home.

There weren' many educational opportunities.

My husband their father, was an alcoholic and would beat me and my children a lot.

>>Since then, she's worked in a plant and flower nursery in Florida.

Enduring long hours hot days and harsh conditions.

Yolanda says she is grateful, however, to have been able to raise her kids in the U.S., but is worried about potential neighborhood raids and being deported.

According to her, she has no family left in Mexico and nothing to go back to.

Do you consider this your country?

>>Well, right now I'm a little embarrassed to say it, but I do like it.

And I consider it my country.

I've been here for 23 years now.

>>As uncertainty faces millions of immigrants, with or without documents.

President elect Trump has vowed to move quickly on his immigration plans, but immigrant rights groups have cast doubt on his administration's abilit to carry out mass deportations and have already begun filing lawsuits to try to protect those in fear of removal.

>>Krystel Knowles reporting there.

Well, the incoming administration's plan certainly have some support.

Polling shows public backing for deportations has grown in recent years, but a majority still favors a pathway to legalization.

The founder and president of the Nonpartizan Florida Policy Project, Jeff Brandis, is a former Republican state senator.

He's critical of the Biden administration, and he says he backs a balanced approach to immigration.

>>Th United States needs immigrants.

It's a country of immigrants, but we need a legal, proces by which to bring peopl into this country.

And we can't have, hug amounts of illegal immigration and have a sustainable pathway, especially for providing government services on the back end to those who are in need.

So there is a balance that have to be struck.

But clearly the last administration, let things go and, really had a border policy that was unsustainable.

And I don't think anybody from either party believes that it was a sustainable to just allow for millions of people to resettle here on an annual basis.

So we have to find a pathway forward.

I think there will be this hard pendulum swing to the right.

But but ultimately, we've got to find a way to have legal immigration that meets the demands of this country that, that allows people to seek opportunity and hop and that we're getting the best and brightest from around the world.

>>Former Republican state senator Jeff Brandis, founder of the Florida Policy Project.

Well, let's bring in our panel now to break it all down.

Joining us in the studio this week, Randi Hildreth from Fox 35.

Good to see you, Randi.

>>Good to see you.

>>Joe Mario Pedersen, Central Florida Public Media.

Nice to see you, Joe Mario.

>>Good to be here.

>>And for the first time here on the program Massiel Leyva from Spectrum News 13.

Thanks for coming in.

You've covered a lot of these immigration issues, so we're excited to have you.

Randi, let me start with you on this one, and we'll talk about unauthorized immigration if we can, which the president elect has sort of said will be a priority for for enforcement.

Big picture.

Do we get a sense of how dependent Florida's economy is on undocumented labor?

>>Well, this has certainly been a big topic of the conversation.

The impact of these policies if we focus just on Florida.

Some have argued that there could be a significant impac on Florida's economy if we roll out these mass deportation policies.

For context, 5% of Florida's population, or roughly 1.1 million residents, are considered undocumented.

So just workin with the framework of numbers.

>>That's a lot.

>>Now, exactly.

So people who are pro-immigration reform are arguing that undocumented immigrants may take from the economy.

But some analysts researchers are quick to point out that undocumented immigrants are really adding to at the just the fabric of our society, but dollars and cents.

I read an article this morning from the Florida Policy Institute.

They released a report in July of 2024, indicating that $1.8 billion in state and local taxes are paid by undocumented immigrants.

We're talking sales tax, property taxes, business income taxes.

In addition to just focusing on the numbers, we also have to look at the jobs that undocumented immigrants typically hold.

We're talking construction agriculture tourism industries that really keep our state thriving.

Central Florida, for example, or Disney World.

The tourism industry is a bustling part of what keeps Central Florida running, for example.

>>Yeah, and I want to talk about that in a moment.

I want to talk about agriculture first, which the state estimates to be about an $8 billion industry thereabouts.

I mean, what are the projections, Joe Mario, for how the incoming administration's enforcement plans might affect farms, particularly?

If you're looking at the workforce, about 40% of the agricultural workforce is estimate to be undocumented immigrants.

Right.

And like Randi was saying, as far as that's concerned, if you remove those people that has huge economic impacts on all of us.

You know, Americans actually have, enjoy some pretty great benefit from the labor of undocumented immigrants, right?

With with them working.

We we see more revenue, obviously, for farmers.

And with that, more revenue, there's more jobs, more jobs, there's more money going into the economy.

Of course, that is able to keep taxes lower because, as you mentioned, you know, undocumented immigrants also have a positive impact on that.

So, you know, you remove that and you see less revenue, you see less jobs, and you see higher taxes.

>>Florida's new State Senat president was asked about this issue recently in, in a briefing that I watched.

He said that H-2a visas actually account for the vast majority of labor in agriculture industry, pushing backs to a certain extent on on whether or not it would have a big impact on that industr in terms of, potential impact.

Can we look at the outcome of Florida's 2023 immigration law, and we will talk about this, in a moment.

That includes penalties, right, for hiring undocumented workers.

How's that worked out for farmers?

>>Well, we can look at, SB 1718 that was passed in 2023.

We did a story recently, an we went to Pierson in Florida.

It's a town in Volusia County-- >>A lot of fern farming-- >>Yes, ferneries out there.

And I had the opportunit to talk to a farm worker who said, there is a lot of fea among that farmer population.

They don't kno what's going to happen after that law went into effec with the E-Verify system.

Now they're seeing less peopl wanting to be out there working.

They don't want to risk their lives.

They are in fear of being deported.

So we are seeing a decline in this number of workers who want to be out there working these ferneries.

These are hard jobs, as they mentioned.

Like, no everyone wants to do this jobs.

And after that bill became law, now it's been harder on farm workers to actually find that workforce to work.

The ferneries for example.

>>Those are the workers.

Has there been pushback from the industry?

>>Yeah, we have had, people who work in the agriculture industry, farmers who have you know, brought this up when, president elect Trump was in office previously and are sounding the alarm again now.

I'm hoping that their sector gets a little bit more leniency.

Maybe, than others because, as you mentioned, they need people to work these job and they're concerned about the, ripple effect of if we don't have people who are able to harvest our fields, what happens to the food supply chain, what that means for people when they go to the grocery store?

Now, the borders are, with the Trump administration has said-- >>Tom Homan, yeah.

>>Yeah.

He has said that the focus initially will be on criminals and peopl with final deportation orders, but has indicated that no one will be above the law.

>>Let's talk about tourism a little bit, which you referred to, just now.

You've covered the flow of Haitians.

Right into Central Florida.

There's a security crisis, I think we all know in that country.

Florida has got the largest population of Haitians in the United States.

Many of them hold temporary protected status.

That was extended by the Biden administration last year.

President elect, as we mentioned earlier, has promised to end that program.

Could that hav do we think a significant effect on hospitality, central Florida?

>>Oh, yeah.

Yeah, absolutely.

And, you know, I'm glad you bring that up because like that's that's Central Florida's bread and butter, right.

So I mean, as far as that's concerned, we we're pretty sur we're going to see a huge impact if that does come to pass.

Right.

So, you know looking at numbers from the last five years and granted, this does not account for, the impact of Haitians that we saw coming last year.

Right.

Seeking refuge.

Disney has reported that it has 500 at least 500 workers who are protected by TPS.

Right.

Rosen Hotel Resorts has reported, over 1000 of its workers.

Right.

So we're talking about just 1500 i just those two entities, right?

I think overall, Florida has at least 45,000 Haitians that are protected under this status.

So, yeah, we're talking about a huge impact.

>>The Bide administration has introduced, humanitarian parole, I think, for Haitians as well as Cubans, Nicaraguans, Venezuelans, that was an effort to sort of cut unauthorized arrivals I guess, from those countries.

It did.

It refused to extend it, though last year.

You've covered this one Massiel.

What did you find in term of potential impacts, the Biden administration's decision there?

>>Well this might have a huge impact.

Why?

Because, under this humanitarian parole program, more than 500,000 people already arrived here to the US legally.

So they have authorization to live and wor legally for two years in the US.

What happens now since Biden said we're not going to extend this program when that two years come to an end, that person is going to receive a DHS letter saying you have to find another program, another way to adjust your status.

>>Maybe TPS.

>>TPS is one of the options.

But if they are not applicable or maybe they're not eligible for TPS deportation or going back to where they came from.

And these are people who have been working for two years here living legally.

So that leaves them in a limbo.

>>Or if TPS even exists at that point.

Biden administration, of course, has taken a lot of criticism, Randi, for its enforcement of immigration laws.

I'm wondering what the deportation numbers look like, though.

Now, as we come to the end of the Biden term.

>>I want to give you specific numbers.

So U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement released its latest report out in December that breaks down how many people have been deported, how many people have been arrested at the border.

Their numbers sho that more than 270,000 people, people representing 192 countries have been deported over a 12 month period.

Again that report out December 2024, that is double from the year before.

U.S. Customs and Borde Protection authorities also made about 46,000 arrests of people crossing the border illegally from Mexico in November.

That is a decrease in the number of people who have been arrested, and some may point to, that is a good indication of what has been ruled out by the Biden administration, also potentiall a joint partnership with Mexico, where we have seen increased enforcement on their end of the border.

>>Really interesting subject, for sure.

We're going to continue the conversation in a moment, but be sure to join the conversation yourselves on social media.

We're at WUCF on Facebook, X, and Instagram.

Well governor DeSantis said this week he wants the Florida legislature to hold a special session to prepare for immigration measures likely to be implemented in the second Trump administration.

So let's talk a bit about some of the upcoming legislative efforts already in motion on the state level.

Newly elected stat Senator Randy Fine from Brevard has filed a bill for this year' session to end in-state tuitio for dreamers, including DACA recipients.

DACA Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals is an Obama era program.

Florida State Senate Presiden Ben Albritton says he supports phasing out the in-state tuition policy over time, and he says he's ope minded about allocating Florida resources to assisting federal deportation efforts.

>>I want to be part of the solution because I mean what I say I believe that citizenship matters.

It should it should matter.

It's what this country is founded on.

You know, let's see what happens and then let's see what Florida, how Florida, the Florida Senate, Florida House executive office, the governor, let's see what it all looks like and figure out.

You know what tha what that looks like for Florida resources.

>>Florida Senate President Ben Albritton there.

Massiel let me come to you first on this one.

To start with the issue of tuition for dreamers.

How many dreamers do we know currently benefit, from in-state tuition in Florida.

And sort of what's the potential financial impact for that?

I mean, the president elect has said he's kind of open to finding a solution for dreamers, right?

>>Yes.

We know that we have more than 408,000 dreamers now who were benefiting from these programs, paying in-state tuition.

Now, if this comes through and they no longer can pay in-state tuition, the difference and the financial impact is going to be huge.

Why?

Because let's take for example UCF.

So in-state tuition in UCF could be $5,900 versus out-of-state tuition.

It could be $20,000.

So we know that's a large sum of money.

And it could make a difference between you can go to college and you cannot afford to go to college.

>>Yeah.

And president Albritton has also sai he wants this to be phased out.

So the families that are planning that are planning that financial mathematics are not suddenly lumbered with a huge increase in fees.

Senator Fine, of course, is a candidate for Congress now in Mike Waltz's Volusia district.

But what are the provisions of his proposed state legislation to end that reduced tuition?

>>They're saying tha they're going to phase it out.

That's going to be a little by little.

But at the same time, you hav the students who no longer know any other country as their home.

They have been here, they have studied here they have gone to school here.

And now if this happens, it's going to have a big impact in their lives.

And it's it's huge.

It's a lot of people going to college now who might have to think about what's going to happen for m next year.

>>On the DACA issue.

I mean how high are the stakes Randi?

I mean, it seems from what Massiel is saying, that they are pretty substantial for those who face deportation, should immigration hardliners get their way.

>>So when we talk about, DACA recipients, they're now in their 30s, so integrated into society.

They are parents, they are homeowner or they are entrepreneurs, s very active members of society.

And so there's some concer that if they move forward with, getting rid of these protection that we will one, as a society, start to lose peopl who have contributed to society.

But, these, families will have to be torn apart.

I was looking at some numbers, and I read one estimate about 13,000 children, which the apparent at risk of deportation.

So there's a lot of concern about what happens next right now.

Senator Fine's bill, I think, is only one of the bills that legislatio that legislators might consider this upcoming session, certainly more if there's a special session.

But what else is on the docket?

>>So I guess also on the docket, to be a lookout for here is Representative Joel Rodman's, HB 71, and what the representative is proposing is, a law that would prevent undocumented immigrants from filing civil action.

They would still be able to, file for criminal charges in any criminal case.

But he believes that this would dissuade, people from outside the country from coming here and seeking refuge in Florida and getting some kind of big payday.

>>Yeah, the government discussed immigration.

The governor, I should say, discussed, immigration this week.

What have state leaders had t say about the potential import implication of mass deportations in Florida and whether or not they'll support them?

>>I think if you asked me this question a couple months ago, the answer might have been different.

State leaders, fo some time had said we will defer to the federal governmen for mass deportation policies.

But in the last few months, and this week, we have started to see state lawmakers and state leaders have an opinion or at least voice their opinio about mass deportation policies.

We heard the clip about the governor speaking this week about potentially being open to a special session where lawmakers are brought together.

They are expected to talk about a couple of things, but specifically how to prepare Florida for potential rollout of this mass deportation.

You also mentioned, state lawmakers saying that they are open potentially to giving money for, the deportation policies.

And this is not a, a, an easy lift.

The numbers that have come ou about how much it would cost US taxpayers across the country we're looking at the billions.

But not everyone feels that way.

Democratic Representative Anna Eskamani, on the flip side, has come out and said she is against, continued discussions because of the impac that this could have on Florida.

>>Yeah, Democrat certainly pushing back for sure.

You can find a link to both the bills we've discussed here for the 2025 session on our website at wucf.org/NewsNight.

So let's talk more abou Florida's 2023 immigration law and its potential impacts as we head into 2025.

As we mentioned earlier, the legislature passed a sweeping immigration law, which, among other things, requires businesses to check their employees immigration status through E-Verify.

That's a federal program.

The law has faced a court challenge over its provisions for penaltie for intentionally transporting unauthorized immigrants into Florida.

Here's governor DeSantis at the bill signing in 2023.

>>We're protecting Floridians with the full exten of our powers to do that.

But, it's sad.

It's sad to see what's happened.

It's sad to see these image of the lawlessness.

It's sad to hear the stories of the people that have been victimized b people coming across the border.

It's sad to see the the mothers who've lost children, as a result of fentanyl overdose.

This has taken a big toll on our country.

And, Florida is fighting back.

>>Governor DeSantis there.

Florida has take several steps on border issues in the areas of human trafficking and in sanctioning companies working with the Biden administration on the transportation of migrants.

Massiel let me start with you, on this one.

Since Florida's immigration legislation passed in 2023, what kind of impacts have we seen?

How is it working?

>>Well we can go back to agriculture.

We know that this is an industry that's been widely impacte by this, as we're talking about.

We know that here in Florida about 130,000 undocumented immigrants are married to U.S. citizens and up to 200,000 seasonal and migrant undocumented workers.

So that's a large number of people who are undocumented and they work as farm workers.

So this law will potentially impact economics here in Florida.

And we know that that could cost Florid to enforce it up to $12 billion.

So big impact for sure.

>>What are you seeing?

>>Whe we talk about how it is working I think someone argued that when it was drafted and signed into law, the hope that it may have a chilling effect.

And if that was the intention potentially we are seeing this.

There was a survey don in Hillsborough County that spoke with, undocumente immigrants and then immigrants who are legally allowed to be in the United States.

And it was interesting that, about 40, a little over 40% say that they knew someon who had decided to leave Florida because of the new laws that are being rolled out.

So if the intention was t to make people concerned or to kind of force people out, then some would argued is working.

>>An of course, backers of the bill say this is not about a chilling effect.

This is just about enforcing the laws that the federal government should be enforcing.

The Florida legislation, also requires hospitals, Joe Mario, to ask for th immigration status of patients.

I think you and I have discussed this on the program before.

There is a similar rule in Texas.

I think we talked about this when it was first signed into law.

What have we seen since then?

>>Well, we've seen a lot.

But, you know, important caveat to that-- >>We should say, by the way, that you cover health care.

>>I do-- >>Which is wh we're asking you this question.

>>And we did a big project on this, over at Central Florid Public Media.

And, you know, as you said you're absolutely correct.

Hospitals were required to as that citizenship question.

Right.

But patients were not required to answer that question.

The question just had to be asked.

So that being said, we got this dashboard, regarding the 2023 year, about what health care look like, and how undocumented immigrants may have impacted that.

Right.

And what that dashboard showed us was with 5 million emergency department visits, less than 1% accounted for undocumented immigrants.

Right.

That's not the number I think, that Florida leaders were hoping to see with that publicly available information, the number that they have been throwing around, though, has been the $566 million of expenses incurred.

Right.

But critics have a problem with that number, too.

And mostly it's because we don't really understand the methodology of how we got to that number.

Expenses incurred is not the same thing as the cost of care, right?

Because expenses incurred, it doesn't account for what has been reimbursed.

Right.

And we're talking about insurance, and undocumented immigrants can have private insuranc right through marriage status, for example.

Right.

So we don't know what that actual number, what the cost of care actually looks like, nor do we know how many people actually contributed to that.

Before we move on, though, I do want to make note of the fact that for the 2024 or 2025, fiscal year, Governor Ron DeSantis did recommend $558 million for the continued gathering of that data.

>>Well, it's a fascinating subject, and I think we could probably talk about it all day, but we are all out of time.

Sadly, before we go, as we mentioned on the show last week, several new laws came into force on January 1st here in Florida.

One of them, Florida's law on homelessness.

People can now sue local governments if they did not enforce th state's ban on public camping.

We'll be talking about the legislation next week as part of a collaborative initiative of independent local news outlets working towards a more informed and engaged Central Florida.

Join us for that next Friday night at 8:30 here on WUCF.

But that's all the time we have for this week.

My thanks to Randi Hildreth, Joe Mario Pedersen, and Massiel Leyva.

Thank you guys so much for coming in.

>>Thanks for having-- >>Thanks for having us.

>>A good conversation today.

We'll see you next Friday night at 8:30 here on WUCF.

From all of us here at NewsNight.

Take care and have a great week.